discussion
steve912
WashingtonPostarticlecomments.docxVirginia SGP
3/2/2016 10:06 PM MST [Edited]
This is why we shouldn't be teaching Islam in high school . In order to teach it fairly, we would have to admit that there are large parts of the Muslim world who are literally prepared to kill to prevent blasphemy laws from being overturned. Think about that. We have enshrined the freedom of speech. Muslims in numerous countries are willing to kill to prevent that same freedom in their country. And yet we are told that all "true" Muslims are peaceful. Clearly that is not true. I'm not saying that all Muslims are violent, far from it. But the notion that we can decide that such a large portion of the Muslim world practices a "false version" of Islam is simply not credible.
June Kinoshita
I would want my children to have at least the minimum level of understanding of Islam as portrayed in the examples shown above. Ditto for the other great world religions, which the story clearly states is done at the school. And the idea of asking students to try reproducing calligraphy is a fantastic way to introduce them to a complex and beautiful writing system. These anti-Islamic parents are no better than anti-Christian Muslims who would ban their children from learning about Western cultures and religions. To say the "other side" does this is a truly sad justification. Surely we want to set ourselves a higher bar. I do take issue with the textbook statement that "most Muslim's faith is stronger than Christians'." No one can know what goes on in a person's heart or how strong their faith truly is. A more factual statement would be that "A higher percentage of Muslims than Christians attend places of worship and practice the tenets of their faith."
Virginia SGP
2/27/2016 1:59 PM MST
This is a very difficult subject to discuss in schools beyond the political implications of Islam's expansion throughout Europe and the Middle East. For example, should we say that: 1. Large majorities in Muslim countries today think it should be illegal to publish images of Muhammed or speak ill against Islam? 2. Significant numbers of Muslims in other countries believe ISIS is justified in its actions? 3. Significant numbers of Muslims today think it should be a capital crime for a Muslim to convert to another religion? 4. That genital mutilation still is a common practice in many Muslim countries today. Many of these topics are better left for college which is not compulsory. Professors are better versed in the complexities of these issues than high school teachers. I have nothing against learning but can you admit that this subject is volatile and the chance of the discussion going off the rails is not insignificant?
Vestal Taylor
3/1/2016 9:57 PM MST
The introduction of Christian topics into a high school atmosphere is just as volatile and has just as big a chance of going off the rails but the topic is not opposed as vehemently as Islam. As far as waiting until college for children to be introduced to volatile topics, what good does this actually serve? By the time people reach college age they have a lifetime of indoctrination by their parents and peers. What are the odds that any of them will actually learn something? Why is the teaching of the existence of a thing or idea and the workings of that thing or idea automatically branded as an attempt to inculcate a person to that thing or idea? Islam is bad just as Christianity is bad. Islam is good just as Christianity is good. What better way is there to fight against that which is bad and support that which is good if not knowledge of the thing or idea? Ignorance based in fear never ends well for anyone.
Virginia SGP
3/2/2016 4:16 AM MST
Vestal Taylor, it's rather simple. You cannot have an honest discussion of Islam, the good and the bad, in high school because they are public schools which require the gov't to steer clear of the establishment of religion. And the teachers are simply not knowledgeable on all the details of the religions. Professors are much more capable to leading these discussions. Kids sign up for these courses in college (e.g. comparison of world religions) knowingly with an understanding of what will be covered. They are paying for those classes btw. You seem to suggest that it is the government's responsibility in K-12 to overcome the "indoctrination" of children by their parents. That the expert K-12 teachers must reach these students before their values are set. Do you seriously believe that? College (late teens/early twenties) are the most formative years in a person's life. It is during this period that kids often form their own political and religious beliefs, branching out from their family's customs. And they are considered adults at that age. I would venture to say that I am quite knowledgeable about Islam overall, including its current practice throughout the world. While I understand how folks could practice Islam based on a completely overhauled and modernized view, I am surprised that anyone could adhere to the original tenets of Islam. Are you suggesting I am just too "ignorant" or "dumb" to understand Islam? Note that I am not trying to push my views on others. But uninformed teachers shouldn't be doing the same to our kids.
OneManOneWomanForever
The school system is wrong in preventing any parent who is not a threat to people or property. The principle should be fired, and the local school board should be put on notice.
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Julie Harbinger
Islam must be taught from a purely kaffir and apostate point of view in our advanced western civilisation base on individual freedoms and human rights founded on the principles of christianity. To do otherwise is to deliberately invite the ideology of islamic jihadism which will certainly destroy the future of our children and subject them to the trauma of the inhumanity of sharia islam, which today, is the same thing as communist tyranny.
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Virginia SGP
2/25/2016 12:37 PM MST
Question. Should schools also teach about Aisha ? Nine years old.....
Vestal Taylor
2/27/2016 4:02 AM MST
You're just playing the devil's advocate aren't you Julie? I mean, you're not really a racist bible thumper are you?
Virginia SGP
What exactly was the "threat"? Schools are interpreting an old legal case as giving them carte blanche permission to ban parents from school grounds. This is not true. If they cannot prove he made a physical threat or that he disrupted student activities, the school will lose. There are about 6-8 of these cases in the courts in the last couple of years, all of them winning based on the over-reaction of schools. Officials need to learn they can't use their official power ("color of law") to prevent citizens from criticizing them, even on school grounds.
June Kinoshita
2/27/2016 6:36 AM MST
The story implies that this parent did make a threat that required them to ban him from school grounds. Neither side can provide details of what those alleged threats were because they are in the middle of a legal case.
Virginia SGP
2/27/2016 1:53 PM MST
Why can't they prove it? I'm in the middle of the same thing with Loudoun County and I post my entire complaints and statements online. If you have nothing to hide, there is no fear of sharing the truth.
mr. parker
Where's the fanatic Freedom From Religion Foundation on this? They seem to get involved in every other similar case.
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They skipped the good questions, probably intentional. Look up this controversy and search around enough and you will find the rest of the questions. If your wondering why he got mad, they are kinda sorta, definitely loaded questions in the work they had the students do. One even that puts islam over christianity. Also wasn't there this big thing about no christianity in school. I swear the left was going on and on saying separation of church and state you can't talk religion in public schools. Also that thing about speaking their history, instead of pissing out propaganda try to actually teach about arts created as the result of Islam and maybe famous ideas. Speak of philosophers and famous people that surrounded the middle east, while avoiding the religious teaching of said people. Rather than teaching the beliefs of the religion. Teach people of that what surrounds the religion, not what is inside of it. And never force the students to write that islam is a religion of peace. These same people would never let chrisitians do that in the same scenario. Also history doesn't show it being nearly as peaceful as it is being made out to be. Anyone who does any research, remember check information from all sides of the spectrum left and right, always be on the look out for bias as well because there is always plenty of it to go around. I stand by Richard Dawkins on this. Stay strong Dawkins we need you.
Mike Davis
A voucher system and gut the bleeding heart liberals in public education.
Salt Life Guy
Well- then the Sermon on the mount by Jesus needs to be studied in detailed. But the real issue here is that we are forced to learn about Mohammed and force people to believe that Islam=Peace? If that is so, one needs to study Sura from the Qur'an that talks about throat cutting and killing infidels wherever you find them. A better study would be where do Muslim terrorist get their beliefs from? The must get it somewhere?? And no, it is not a misinterpretation of scriptures. It is clearly written in the chapters of Sura.
Marain
Oh, and when they studied the Renaissance, did they have to learn the prayer to acknowledge they're sinners and ask Christ to become Lord of their lives? Did they have to learn and recite the Ten Commandments? I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say probably not. If the statement of faith does not convert you to Islam, then why is it a requirement to become a Muslim?
PolllyW
3/1/2016 9:33 AM MST
you don't have to go out on a limb Marain, they don't study the Ten Commandments and they do not go into Christian beliefs, just that it is bad and what awful things Christians have done. The teacher repeated islam is a religion of peace at least 130 times during the 7 to 8 weeks she went through this subject... It's the most bizarre class my 7th grader ever took
scot1
What on earth has happened to the idea of separation of church and state? Since when does the study of any religion in a public, state funded school, include reciting any part of religious writings, or to comparing the "strength" of any religion to another? I suspect those who approve of this are afraid of Muslim backlash. I certainly hope this gets to a very high level court and that the residents of Charles County think seriously about what their schools are teaching the future generation. Religious tolerance is to be respected, but this action by the teacher and the school administration flies in the face of the concept. I have taken college level classes in religion- none of them came even close to this type of teaching. This father is to be applauded!!
TexasCzechChick
Okay, what the hell? Christianity sure as hell cannot be taught in public schools in Texas. How dare they bar that father from her daughter's graduation over that? He has every right to be concerned. Again, not all Muslims are terrorists, but these days it seems all terrorists are Muslims. NO RELIGION should be taught in a public school system. Religion and faith is taught at home, and in the church, synagogue, mosque of one's choice. NOT IN SCHOOL. GRRRRRRRRR.
Skyline1
2/24/2016 5:32 PM MST [Edited]
How dare they bar that father from HIS daughter's graduation. I suppose it's because he was acting in a threatening manner. The rest of the graduates and their families safety must take first consideration.
Marain
2/24/2016 7:27 PM MST
You "suppose"? Way to choke down whatever you're told.
Davoritz
If the public schools were really so interested in educating students about religion, in addition to having them learn and recite the 5 pillars of Islam and the shahada, why aren't they also requiring students to learn and recite the Apostle's Creed, or the Ten Commandments, or the Lord's Prayer? Short answer: they're opposed to Christianity and its influence in our culture, and actually prefer any other religion over Christianity, a clear violation of our Constitution. Bravo Zulu to parents who push back against these educational tyrants!
Skyline1
2/24/2016 4:30 PM MST
This harping on "the public schools" is really silly. Your public schools are staffed by people who live in your communities, who are hired by local school boards which are usually elected. Teachers, principals, and superintendents can be chosen from husbands and wives of people who live in the community, from children and grandchildren of community members who have gone to university and return home. Don't blame the "public schools." If YOU are concerned get an education and teach in your local public schools and contribute to their betterment, assuming you have any ideas and ability to do so.
Marain
2/24/2016 7:29 PM MST
You don't seem to understand how the public school system works. Teachers teach what they are told by the State to teach or they get fired.
Millennial Lawyer
Is this really happening? Islam being taught in our public schools in this fashion -- it is something that a year ago, someone with a tin foil hat would have been raving about and we'd all think he was losing it. But here it is, happening.
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Skyline1
2/24/2016 5:29 PM MST
It was over a year ago. read the article.
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Skyline1
One might think the parents would be more concerned because their junior in high school doesn't know how to spell "messenger." I don't think they need to worry too much that writing a few words about Islam is going to stick in her head and cause her any future problems, unless they are afraid she doesn't really believe in the family's Christian religion.
TexasCzechChick
2/24/2016 3:12 PM MST
The problem is that the "Christian Religion" cannot be taught in public schools. Why in the hell is the school teaching about Islam???
Skyline1
2/24/2016 4:12 PM MST
Although I'm not sure if you know anything about math, science, sociology, psychology, government, fine arts and practical arts, technology, engineering, music, history, geography, world religions and cultures, and health and sports, but if you do I assume you find all that information beneficial and interesting. Schools are always teaching things about religion, including the Christian religion, as it pertains to other subjects and fields of study. They simply aren't teaching kids to BE Christians, Jews, Muslims or ... . I assume you profess to know something about Islam. If so, why do you think high school students should be kept ignorant about Islam?
PolllyW
2/26/2016 9:49 PM MST
It's the way it's being taught. My 7th grader had to endure the teacher repeating at least 5 times a class that "islam is a religion of peace" it ended up being said at least 130 times. We were patient thinking there would be catch phrases for the other religions, there was not. When the teacher got to Christianity she bashed it , she barely said a word about Jewish people other than to state they were the book people and they had to pay the tax ,convert ....the or die part which was skimmed over quietly ..... extremely bias teaching
mike_in_cinci
I wonder if the class is taught the Lord's Prayer? The Ten Commandments? Other tenets of various faiths?
TexasCzechChick
2/24/2016 3:13 PM MST
Oh, if I was a gambling woman I would say hell no, they are NOT.
BuzzyG
Well, as a Roman Catholic I want my religion taught in public schools.
TexasCzechChick
2/24/2016 3:16 PM MST
Exactly. And Jews, Baptists, Presbyterians, Methodists, Lutherans, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc.. should all be taught too??? Where does it stop??? And Islam of ALL things? At this time in history when THAT is the religion of most terrorists???
Dix Lee
I'm not a Marine. I spent 6 years in the US Army, 2 of which were in Vietnam. I am a retired Fire Service officer. I am also a retired class room teacher. I taught a comparative religions class for many years. I believed then, as I do now, it is vitally important for students to learn the basic tenets of the major religions. As a teacher I was never into memorization. For me, it was always about stimulation of the thought process and critical thinking. My basic approach was , "Here it is, what do you think?" I haven't seen the Maryland curriculum, so I cannot comment on how the teacher presented on religions other than Islam. But here's what I will say, at what point did this young Marine and his wife accompany their child to school and sit in the class to gain first hand knowledge of what was being taught? I'd venture not once.
DorisP
La Plata High School Principal Evelyn Arnold filed for a no-trespass order against Kevin Wood of La Plata Thursday, Oct. 23. "The assignment has been given for years," said Katie O'Malley-Simpson. "This particular parent had a problem with the assignment last Thursday. "It is unusual [to ban a parent from a school]," she added. "We don't file no trespassing charges lightly. We would only do that when we feel someone has threatened the safety of staff and students."
BuzzyG
2/24/2016 11:55 AM MST
I am Roman Catholic and I want my religion taught in public schools!
CherokeeCol
Were the students required to memorize the Ten Commandments? Of course not. To assume that Christianity was studied as part of their studies of the Renaissance is an astonishing statement. For one, the Renaissance was mostly about establishing a secular European society apart from the grip of the Roman Catholic Church; and, if the students "studied" anything it was likely the structure and the foibles of the Catholic church and not Judea-Christianity. Finally, why study Islam? It's the religion of terrorists and not worthy of the world's respect.
P D Kluge
2/24/2016 8:17 AM MST
So you favor ignorance over knowledge, so that America's children can be like you, correct?
Efthymis Mironidis
In middle east they used to live milions of christians my ancestors of greek origin simply because they were christians they expelled from they areas and see they houses burnt.and today islam flourishes in Europe and here in America. And none talks about the persecution of Christians in middle east.. The marine is a good man. Unless I see churches build in Saudi Arabia i don't want to hear a word about islam in our western world
claire_1
The school system went too far in this case. Based upon the lesson plan they went beyond what was necessary to make the plan understandable and crossed the line between informing and promoting.
Vestal Taylor
2/24/2016 5:04 AM MST
How so?
Phil50
2/24/2016 5:41 AM MST
By requiring citation and memorization.
jafeigen
2/24/2016 6:38 AM MST
By mixing positive information about Islam with normative judgements about Christianity vs Islam. Teaching what Muslims believe is perfectly fine. Comparing Christians to Muslims is inappropriate. The father actually does have a point here, though he also went too far.
dc777
2/24/2016 5:48 AM MST [Edited]
So is teaching about the Holocaust promoting Fascism? Or Judaism? Since most American kids can't read, write or compute at grade level, it's doubtful most of it sunk in anyway. Perhaps they should just put it all in the Fairy Tales section of the Comparative Literature Class.
Vestal Taylor
This guy is trying to ride on his status as a former Marine and a firefighter to deflect this away from himself. If the school had banned him simply because he threatened to take this public it would have been done and over with by the close of 2014. That it is now at this point pretty much proves that he said something that the administrators considered to be a valid threat. Serving in the military or even in public service does not automatically bestow honor and integrity on a person. Honor and integrity are gained only through how a person chooses to live.
Monica Garner Ramsey
2/24/2016 8:46 AM MST
exactly! Many seem hung up on the fact that he is a Marine. They seem to zero in on that part of him and assume that anything he says is true and he is the good guy. Mix that in with Muslim and he can do no wrong. No other parent complained, he threatened them and harassed them, but everyone just keeps hearing Marine and refuse to even think that maybe he is over reacting..
Victoria Cendreda
I thought that in public schools religion can be taught in the context of "Comparative Religion" without indoctrination or teaching either one to be superior or better than the other. Therefore and furthermore, no mention of the words "one true" in front of any specific God over another.
jafeigen
2/24/2016 6:39 AM MST
That is all correct.
P D Kluge
2/24/2016 8:21 AM MST
Since many religions (including Christianity) teach that their religion is right and other religions are wrong, how do you teach people about religion without acknowledging that aspect of those religions? That's not "indoctrination" - it's "information."
PolllyW
2/24/2016 10:53 AM MST
it's the way the public schools teach it. My daughters 7th grade teacher repeated that islam was " A religion of peace" at least 5 times a class (yes my daughter actually started counting when it starting getting absurd ) during the time they were studying this religion it ended up being over 130 times the teacher repeated this phase. When the teacher was teaching about Christianity, Buddhism,Hinduism, or Judaism she didn't use a catch phase for those religions... sounds like indoctrination to me
Randy L Stubbings
2/24/2016 12:20 PM MST
why is this post politically ok while my post saying virtually the same thing taken down? Good for this Dad! I used to be for religious choice and freedom but this Muslim garbage needs to stop. It calls for EVERYBODY not a Muslim to be killed! If you join and leave you're killed. These so called PEACE loving Muslims aren't condemning the actions of as they claim a "few fanatics" if that's so then go after those Muslims with the same tenacity that you use in a FATWA for a cartoon drawn of ALLAH. You same Muslims then claim CHRISTAINS are evil horrible people but when was the last time a Christian beheaded anybody? Or blow themselves up with a suicide bomb?
DoctorDirt
If "speaking out" includes making threats, the school is not being unfair. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The order...says that Wood “made verbal threats against the school.” The legal battle now centers on whether the school system unfairly punished Wood for speaking out."
Randy L Stubbings
I'll come back you communists
Randy L Stubbings
AGAIN MY POST IS CENSORED thank you Washington Post I made true statements about Muslims. It's YOUR article. You posted my post for 2 minutes then took it down?
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Randy L Stubbings
I made another post. What happened to it? Are we Censoring private opinions that disagree?
2/24/2016 12:04 AM MST
When they're racist and offensive, they don't belong here.
A Shot in the Dark
2/24/2016 7:42 AM MST
What an utterly ridiculous statement! So, people cannot discuss things if someone gets offended? Bye-bye free speech. Time to go back to kindergarten for those with tender ears.
Randy L Stubbings
?
Blue Sunflower
Uhh, the guy acknowledged in the past that yes, he did threaten the school, and THAT is why he was banned. I swear, the rewrite of history by these idiots is astonishing.
Blue delft
The principal and the administrators of this school need to be fired. Why on earth would the kids have to memorize the beliefs of Islam? And why would they be told that Muslims beliefs are stronger than Christians? This is a clear violation of the separation of church and state.
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vdev
2/23/2016 11:02 PM MST
There's nothing that says that they were told that Muslim beliefs were stronger than Christians. This is a "World History" class - do you think that you can understand world history by learning only about how the U.S fought England?? That thinking is what got us into Iraq. As the saying goes, "War is God's way of teaching Americans geography"
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golfrmyx
If the Bible cannot be taught in public schools, neither can the Koran or any other religious book. There is his grounds for suit. As for not attending his daughters graduation, so what. My dad did not attend mine even though the rest of my family did including my grandmother from a small town 500 miles away. My only significant memories of that event are his lack of attendance and that no ones camera functioned when they tried to get pictures of me there even though the cameras worked fine before and after the event. My dad never said a word about not showing up and I never felt slighted. It was no big deal to me. My niece, the salutatorian in her class refused to go to her own graduation. Thus, no one in the family went. This was over a small dispute with one teacher.
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Pudgy Puddleton
2/23/2016 10:57 PM MST
Not entirely true. You cannot promote a religion, but you can explain, in an appropriate class -- like current events or world-cultures, what a religion is based on. But this smells of something missing. Schools don't put court orders out on parents that just call and complain. I strongly expect he threatened someone with bodily harm but forgets to mention that. After all, a judge has to hear and approve the school's complaint against him to create the court order.
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Pudgy Puddleton
2/23/2016 11:00 PM MST
Depends on the class. If it is a class about modern politics, then how exactly can you understand what the political motivations are in the middle east without understanding what their driving beliefs are. Being aware of them is not the same as promoting them, unless your own personal belief system is so fragile just hearing about other religions will convert you. Sort of as lame as the idea that a gay teacher will end up converting the sexuality of students simply because they are aware he/she is gay.
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Patitos
2/23/2016 11:09 PM MST
Who says that bible (myths) are not being taught golfrmyz, was it part of world history? BTW if you read world history you would know that the Muslims helped to bring Europe out of the dark ages during their occupation of the Iberian peninsula.
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Phil50
2/24/2016 5:44 AM MST [Edited]
We can teach world history without requiring citation and memorization of religious rites.
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roberto3
I feel one way to dispell mistrusts between various religius beliefs is to actually allow others to question the tenets of your faith. The eastern religions had always done that and were open to debate. Take India for example- at least for a couple of millenia, between 800 BC and 1100 AD..it was such an open platform for debates - Vedic/Hindu, Sankhya, Shunya, Buddhism, Jainism, etc. Today's Christianity and Islam would be so much well off if they were open to debates like these eastern religions were/are. What are they afraid of? At least our schools should teach comparative religions and encourage debates across knowledgeable people in their respective religions. But I don't know if there will be any takers for such radical ideas in these Abrahamic faiths. Each of these religionists are happy to talk up their own ideas while denouncing the other in secret.
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Blue delft
2/23/2016 10:58 PM MST
The public schools have no reason to teach any type of religion. They should stay out of the religion business altogether.
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dc777
2/24/2016 5:42 AM MST
Uh, they're not teaching religion, they're teaching ABOUT religion, there's a difference. Just because they have to read Beowulf, doesn't mean they have to believe in "Grendel". There is a reason it's called "FICTION".
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Dr. Truth007
THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!! Everyone should have objected to this. Studying different religions is one thing but to force children to write there is no God but allah??? Is another. That is a crime. More and more reason TRUMP IS RIGHT!! Here is a Marine that served his country. How dare this school ban him. Ban this brainwashing!! This is against freedom of speech. I AM SICK OF THIS PC CRAP HURTING OUR OWN PEOPLE! WAKE UP AMERICA!!
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Pudgy Puddleton
2/23/2016 11:02 PM MST
Yeah, we should be outraged that schools are teaching students what the motivations are of other countries and political hotspots are! I mean, next they'll actually be informed voters, have opinions on foreign policy, will understand their Muslim neighbors a little better, etc. The outrage! If you or your kids are converted to a religion simply by being aware of what they believe, then your personal faith is a sham anyway.
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Monica Garner Ramsey
2/24/2016 12:32 AM MST
so you agree this is more than one God? Because Allah is God... and does being a Marine mean you can threaten people? He harassed the school over a world history class because he has a personal dislike over Muslims. He didnt have a problem with the other religions they covered that DON'T believe in the same God as him. maybe he is a bit off balanced?
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Keith Pollard
The real issue here is not that their teaching about Islam but that they are have them write the statement of faith which is against the Cristian faith in our first commandment. I'm sure this teacher knew that and is playing stupid. He should sue for impeding on his daughters right to practice her faith of Christianity. No lesson should cause you to violate your religion.
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Tou Vu
He should have pulled his daughter out of that school if he really believed in what he was saying. I would have and not even think twice about it.
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Patitos
2/23/2016 11:14 PM MST
Right because keeping her ignorant is more healthy for her Tou.
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Jerry Cologne
you can sue them now go for it and sue for millions
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Patitos
2/23/2016 11:14 PM MST
And be prepared to lose Jerry.
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Todd Eastman
Give Charles County to Virginia and be done with this nonsense...
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Alm757
I agreed with Charles Haynes, vice president of the Newseum Institute and founding director of the Religious Freedom Center about “How are we going to live with one another in one of the most religiously diverse societies in the world without understanding one another?” Ahmadiyya Muslim Community is a peaceful organization working whole heartedly for Global Peace Alislam.org and has its moto” Love for All and Hatred for None”. I will suggest Mr, John Wood that if he thinks righteously from the bottom of his heart, he will find Islam a True Religion of Peace, Islam is not a Political religion, it is a religion chosen by God Almighty, (the God of Abraham, Moses and Jesus) for the benefits of mankind please find more about True Islam from Alislam.org or from Trueislam.com. His daughter is only learning World History of Religion as a subject, and other students must also be learning other religion like Judaism, Buddhist, and Hinduism, I think Mr. Wood must not have any objection as subject wise student are only learning “History”. Mr. Wood should have firm faith on his religion.
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dhuffingtnpstsux
2/23/2016 8:55 PM MST
I find it sickening that the absolutely most repressive religion has advocates like you, that completely distort reality. You drone ad nauseum about this father's repressive beliefs, and how Islam only wants to hug people, while your religion KILLS man for being convicted of being gay...which only requires two Muslim men to say so. You're so worried about your, um...short comings, that you force child brides and embrace honor killings that are mostly carried out against your young women for wanting to be with white Americans. Even talking to one of us gets them a beat down,,,yup, religion of peace...believe what I believe...or I kill you.
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Pudgy Puddleton
2/24/2016 1:15 AM MST [Edited]
Funny how conservatives constantly remind us that guns don't kill people, people kill people (with guns btw). But now apparently a religion kills people, not people who follow a religion. Whenever there's a murder or shooting in the US, the only time we seem to care or blame a religion is if it is Muslim, yet the far majority are done by Christians. I am no fan of fanatics of any religion, and am not religious myself, but people of all sorts do bad things and blame certain absurd ideas, but when it comes down to it, you are either a good person or a bad person, and no religion is going to make you do things unless you are willing to let them do it. That is on the person. That's why we can have 1.6 billion Muslims in the world just going about their daily business and around 50K fanatics doing really bad things, and using religion as their excuse to just be awful people. Not really the point of the article though. They are learning about different religions so they can understand the world around them. Their faith isn't being challenged by just being aware other religions exist and what they believe (instead of keeping ones head in the sand and hoping things in the world get better) and if it is, then it is a sham of a faith anyway. And the father was clearly making threats for a judge to approve a court order against him, but he only vaguely admits that was the true reason for the ban.
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Amy Madeoy
I'm guessing the dad was banned because of his behavior, not his objections. However, Islam is a very contentious issue right now and will cause more issues than it will solve so they should just stick to the absolute facts. Public school is not the place to teach religion and present subjective opinion as fact.
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Pudgy Puddleton
2/24/2016 1:24 AM MST [Edited]
Well the 5 pillars being something they believe in is actually fact. Choosing to believe it is the only subjective part. Being aware of what someone else believes is just called being a smart citizen of the world. I mean some of these kids will be killing and being killed in wars directly involving other religions, but we expect them to do so without even understand who they are fighting (and for that matter who they are also dying to protect, like non-radical Iraqis and Afghans)? If just being aware of what a religion believes converts you, then you don't really have much of a faith yourself do you? And yes, public school is exactly a place where you should learn about people not like yourself before you do things like become a voter, or you become a very uninformed voter with a warped sense of the world.
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Natti
Mr. Woods should have spent more time reading the 1st Amendment instead of his bible. The first amendment does not prohibit learning about religion(s). However, it did prohibit the law that was passed in 1956 by the 89th congress and President Eisenhower making “in god we trust” the nations official motto; and injecting “under god” in the Pledge of Allegiance. However, I doubt that this unlawful violation will upset Mr. Woods. Unfortunately, since we live in a country that has not outlawed religion altogether for the absolute insanity that it was… is.. and continues to be, it has become mandatory that ALL religions are understood; this, of course, at the expense of a meaningful education. Religious individuals have a serious problem keeping their religion to themselves. If it wasn’t for the Christians pushing to get their bible back into schools; which would have been “promoting a religion,” then we wouldn’t have this issue of learning about ALL major religions in public schools.
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jtssigman
The title seems a bit misleading. The school was trying to provide a basic understanding of a religion that has had a profound influence on world history, and which currently claims 1.6 billion adherents... How is that objectionable?
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dhuffingtnpstsux
2/23/2016 8:46 PM MST
So, to learn about the history of the USA, you must, no matter what nation is doing the studying, you must recite the pledge of allegiance, including the recent mentions of God? Do you realize that NO nation on earth shares your belief? You study by studying the workings, the people, their processes, but you do NOT recite ANY loyalty oath because you are not pledging loyalty, only studying. There is nothing about Islam's oath, nor ANY religion's oath, nor ANY country's oath that teaches you about that subject.
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Pudgy Puddleton
2/24/2016 1:30 AM MST [Edited]
Well you probably should discuss the Constitution, maybe the Dec. of Independence, and yes, perhaps mention that we say a pledge. So to you, does doing so suddenly mean you have to follow the US Constitution? Have you read the Constitution? The Preamble is very "oathy" but to not discuss it when learning about the US would miss the entire point of what we are, much like learning about what many of our religious conflicts are about without discussing what they believe in wouldn't exactly be learning about another religion. I mean, how exactly would you teach about another religion, learn the name and then move on? I'm not sure that exactly prepares you to understand that religion or its motivations in foreign policy.
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ESECPN
Religion of peace? I needed a laugh. Every nation with Islam as the dominant religion is either a 15th century feudal monarchy or decrepit failed state. And people wonder why Americans are supporting Trump? Trump is a creation of the loony left going over the deep end.
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Johnjohn12
2/23/2016 9:34 PM MST
And comments like this just show the sad state of education in this country. Maybe you could have gotten something out of this class about Islam. The country with the largest population is actually Indonesia a country not even in the Middle East. It's GDP is the 16th largest in the world not such a failed state is it. Islam is not the issue it's religious extremism as a whole. We have such a short memory span but Christianity doesn't have the greatest track record either what about the crusades that killed large amounts of people for no real reason. You can find truly dark moments in history for all major religions. It's learning about each one and learning tolerance that will lead us forward in the right direction not being close minded and thinking that Christianity is the greatest and everyone else sucks. That's a failed thought process.
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Tyrell Williams
2/23/2016 10:46 PM MST
Kinda funny when the CURRENT issue is the recent mass killings done by Islamic zealots then some people would mention about the dark moments of Christianity 8 or 9 centuries ago.Present times people,present times.
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Monica Garner Ramsey
2/24/2016 12:34 AM MST
Tyrell is right, they should teach that most domestic terrorist acts in the USA are done by white male Christians..
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Gertwise
So did he complain about the other religions that were taught in reference to world history? I have a feeling that the answer to that question is no. It is kind of hard to talk about Middle Eastern history and influences without talking about Islam. Just like it's hard to talk about the Renaissance period without talking about Christianity.
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A Shot in the Dark
2/23/2016 7:35 PM MST
His child was made to recite the shahada, the islamic profession of faith. This is akin to making a muslim child recite the Lord's Prayer or the Nicene Creed. It's understandable why the man might get upset.
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Monica Garner Ramsey
2/24/2016 12:36 AM MST
or students who do not believe in God forced to say our Pledge! And answering a question about a religions beliefs by citing their mantra is not trying to make them Muslim..
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David888
2/23/2016 7:55 PM MST
This is more of how America is being taken over my Muslim's. We are slowly being forced to convert while Christian prayers have been banned in schools. We maybe winning the war on their soil but they've definitely made great strides in America too.
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Pudgy Puddleton
2/24/2016 1:33 AM MST [Edited]
Wow, you must have some strong faith if learning what the Islamic 5 pillars are suddenly converts you to Islam. So, then I guess you are fine with removing the "under God" part from the Pledge of Allegiance again since you think mentioning it instantly converts people and clearly not everyone believes in God?
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ShaolinMonkey
2/24/2016 12:25 PM MST
Your fear suggests a lack of confidence in your own faith, nothing more.
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dhuffingtnpstsux
2/23/2016 8:40 PM MST [Edited]
You clearly do not know the back story. When the admin was pressed about the teachings of other religions, she finally admitted that what she meant to say, was that those were to be coming up during the school year. To date...NO other religion has been taught, only referenced. And the reference was incorrect [they blamed Christians for the crusades, instead of the Muslims that attacked them to start the first crusade, and the confused the crusades with the Inquisition, by claiming the crusades were about spreading Christianity]
