HiST 201 Essay 2: What was History to the First Historians? Comparing Herodotus and Thucydides
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HIST201class7.pdf
Today’s Topics (10/22)
Notes from Essays: Take notes!
Recap: Critiquing and Corroborating Herodotus
Discussion: Herodotus and comparative politics
The Ionian Revolt and First Persian Invasion
Discussion: Herodotus, Democracy, and Marathon
Herodotus On and Off Topic
The Second Persian Invasion
For Next Class: READ: Thucydides, Book 1.1-23, 62-88; Book 2.1-33
Example of how to break up next week’s reading
Tuesday 10/23 Read Thucydides History of the Peloponnesian War 1.1-23 (15 pages, 30 – 40 minutes)
Thursday 10/25 Read Thucydides History of the Peloponnesian War 1.62-88 (15 pages, 30 – 40 minutes)
Friday 10/26 Read Thucydides History of the Peloponnesian War 2.1-33 (19 pages, 40 – 55 minutes)
Monday 10/29 Review your reading guide before class so you’re ready for discussion (15 minutes)
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C L A S S I C A L P E R I O D c. 480 - 323 BCE
Persian Wars 490-479 BCE
(Spartan 300, etc.)
Parthenon built 447 - 431 BCE
Peloponnesian War between Athens and Sparta
431-404 BCE
Advent of Athenian democracy
507 BCE
Cyrus the Great King of Persian Empire
c. 559-531 BCE
Herodotus writes between c. 460 – 425 BCE
Thucydides writes c. 410-400 BCE
Croesus king of Lydia c. 560-546 BCE
Cambyses King of Persian Emp.
c. 531-522 BCE
Darius I King of Persian Empire
c. 521-486 BCE
Xerxes I King of Persian Empire
c.485-465 BCE
Artaxerxes I King of Persian Empire
c. 464-424 BCE
Darius II King of Persian Empire
c. 423-405 BCE
L A T E A R C H A I C P E R I O D c. 600 - 480 BCE
Nabonidus king of Babylon c. 555-539 BCE
Unit 2: What was History to the First Historians? Timeline
Ionian revolt c. 499-494 BCE
Battle of Marathon 490 BCE
Battle of Salamis 480 BCE
Plague in Athens
430-429 BCE
Thucydides exiled from Athens
424/423 BCE
Peace of Nicias 422-416 BCE
Pericles’ funeral oration 431 BCE
Pisistratus tyrant of Athens
546-527 BCE
Hippias tyrant of Athens
527-510 BCE
Turmoil after death of Cambyses 522-521 BCE
Amphora (wine jar), made in Athens showing king Croesus of Lydia on the pyre,
c. 480-450 BCE
Sardis, Turkey, capital of king Croesus of Lydia
Fortifications, 7th- 6th century BCE
Gate
Wall
Likely question on the second essay:
Assess how reliable or accurate Herodotus’ Histories are. Be sure to support your answer with references to passages of Herodotus that we have read and evidence that corroborates or contradicts his Histories.
Sardis Athens
GREECE
Babylon
PERSIA (aka ANSHAN)
MEDITERRANEAN SEA
AEGEAN SEA
According to Herdotous, Cyrus overthrew Astyages of Media sometime around 550 BCE, shortly before Cyrus overthrew Croesus of Lydia in 547 - 546 BCE
BLACK SEA
EGYPT
The Babylonian Chronicle of Nabonidus, entry for year 6 of Nabonidus (550-549 BCE) records that:
Ishtumegu (Astyages) called up his army and marched against Cyrus, king of Anshan (Persia), in order to meet him in battle. The army of Ishtumegu (Astyages) revolted against him and in fetters they delivered him to Cyrus.
Translation by Pritchett 1969
The Babylonian chronicle of Nabonidus, entry for year 9 of Nabonidus (547-546 BCE) records that:
…Cyrus, king of Persia, called up his army and crossed the Tigris below the town of Arbela…he marched against the land of (text is broken) and killed its king, took his possessions, put a garrison of his own there.
Translation by Pritchett 1969
Sword of a Lydian soldier Helmet of a Lydian soldier
Burned and collapsed houses
Collapsed fortifications with skeletons underneath
The Persian destruction level at the Lydian capital of Sardis, Turkey, mid 6th century BCE (probably 547 – 546 BCE)
Delphi, site of the oracle of ApolloBecause they were always being beaten in battle by the Tegeans, the Spartans sent ambassadors to Delphi to ask which god they should propitiate (satisfy) so that they could get the upper hand. The priestess (i.e., the oracle) answered that they were to bring home the bones of Agamemnon’s son.
Herodotus, Histories 1.67
When the Spartans can’t find said bones, they ask the oracle where to find them and get in reply:
Where two winds are blown by mighty force, where beat responds to beat and pain is heaped on pain.
Herodotus, Histories 1.67
Who attacked the Küçük Höyük fortress at Gordion in the mid 6th century BCE?
Likely question on the second essay: Assess how reliable or accurate Herodotus’ Histories are. Be sure to support your answer with references to passages of Herodotus that we have read and evidence that corroborates or contradicts his Histories.
Prisoners led to Darius I on the Behistun/Bisitun relief,Iran, c. 521-486 BCE
Cambyses was murdered in 522 BCE, in the ensuing power struggle Darius I became the next king
Review the debate the Persian nobles Otanes, Megabyzus, and Darius had after Cambyses’ death in 522 BCE.
Then talk about how Darius was chosen as king.
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C L A S S I C A L P E R I O D c. 480 - 323 BCE
Persian Wars 490-479 BCE
(Spartan 300, etc.)
Parthenon built 447 - 431 BCE
Peloponnesian War between Athens and Sparta
431-404 BCE
Advent of Athenian democracy
507 BCE
Cyrus the Great King of Persian Empire
c. 559-531 BCE
Herodotus writes between c. 460 – 425 BCE
Thucydides writes c. 410-400 BCE
Croesus king of Lydia c. 560-546 BCE
Cambyses King of Persian Emp.
c. 531-522 BCE
Darius I King of Persian Empire
c. 521-486 BCE
Xerxes I King of Persian Empire
c.485-465 BCE
Artaxerxes I King of Persian Empire
c. 464-424 BCE
Darius II King of Persian Empire
c. 423-405 BCE
L A T E A R C H A I C P E R I O D c. 600 - 480 BCE
Nabonidus king of Babylon c. 555-539 BCE
Unit 2: What was History to the First Historians? Timeline
Ionian revolt c. 499-494 BCE
Battle of Marathon 490 BCE
Battle of Salamis 480 BCE
Plague in Athens
430-429 BCE
Thucydides exiled from Athens
424/423 BCE
Peace of Nicias 422-416 BCE
Pericles’ funeral oration 431 BCE
Pisistratus tyrant of Athens
546-527 BCE
Hippias tyrant of Athens
527-510 BCE
Turmoil after death of Cambyses 522-521 BCE
Persian noble Otanes on democracy in 522 BCE, according to Herodotus:
Majority rule, on the other hand, is called by the fairest of terms: Equality before the Law…people hold office by lot, are accountable for the actions of their administrations, and their deliberations are held in public.
Herodotus 3.80 (translation by Blanco 2013)
Ceramic boxes indicating political status? From Athenian graves, c. 850-750 BCE
Pentakosiomedimnoi? (five grain silo people?)
Hippeis? (horsey people?)
(in c. 590 BCE) As they had been before (i.e., for some time before 590 BCE), the citizens were divided into four classes according to property called Pentakosiomedimnoi (five grain silo people), Hippeis (horsey people), Zeugetai (plowmen), and slaves…the political offices open to each class was related to how much they owned…
Aristotle, Constitution of the Athenians, 7.4 (written c. 350 BCE)
Oligarchies in Greek city states limited powerful political positions to wealthier citizens, who could propose laws, act as judges, etc.
All citizens participated in the assembly, in which laws were debated and voted on
All settlements in Attica were within 35 miles from Athens and most settlements were within 15 miles… meaning it would be possible to travel to Athens from anywhere in Attica in one day or less
There was tension over wealth and political participation in many oligarchic Greek city states in the Archaic period
A wealthy Athenian named Cleisthenes came to power in 507 BCE by promising reforms
Two major features of Athenian Democracy:
Officials and lawmakers were chosen from among all citizens by lot (at random) and spend a month out of their year of service in Athens coming up with laws.
All citizens met between 12 and 40 times a year in Athens to deliberate proposed legislation in public and vote on it.
The Pnyx Hill in Athens, meeting place of the assembly
All settlements in Attica were within 35 miles from Athens and most settlements were within 15 miles… meaning it would be possible to travel to Athens from anywhere in Attica in one day or less
The Persian Empire was almost 3000 miles across in the time of Darius, it would take several months to travel to Persepolis from most places in the empire
Persia itself is over 900 miles across, meaning that it would take weeks or months to travel to Persepolis from many places in Persia
910 miles
Persian noble Otanes on democracy in 522 BCE, according to Herodotus:
Majority rule, on the other hand, is called by the fairest of terms: Equality before the Law…people hold office by lot, are accountable for the actions of their administrations, and their deliberations are held in public.
Herodotus 3.80 (translation by Blanco 2013)
Persepolis, Iran, the Persian capital built by Darius I, c. 520 - 486 BCE
Persepolis
Pasargadae
The Apadana (audience hall) at Persepolis, Iran, c. 520 – 486 BCE
Reliefs from the Apadana stairs at Persepolis, Iran, tribute c. 520 – 486 BCE
Scythians with horses and textiles
Cilicians with rams
Indians with donkeys Bactrians with Bactrian camels
Reliefs from the Apadana stairs at Persepolis, Iran, tribute c. 520 – 486 BCE
Persepolis
Reliefs from the Apadana stairs at Persepolis, Iran, c. 520-486 BCE
Babylonians bringing a bull, textiles, metal drinking bowls
Syrians bringing horses, metal jewelry, jugs, and bowls
Scythians with horses and textiles
Cilicians with rams
Discuss whether or not Herodotus’ description of tribute in the Persian Empire corresponds with the depiction of the tribute bearers on the Apadana reliefs.
Syrians with horses, metal jewelry, jugs, and bowlsBabylonians bringing a bull, textiles, metal drinking bowls
Prisoners led to Darius I on the Behistun/Bisitun relief, Iran, c. 521-486 BCE
6 0
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5 0
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C E
5 5
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4 0
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C L A S S I C A L P E R I O D c. 480 - 323 BCE
Persian Wars 490-479 BCE
(Spartan 300, etc.)
Parthenon built 447 - 431 BCE
Peloponnesian War between Athens and Sparta
431-404 BCE
Advent of Athenian democracy
507 BCE
Cyrus the Great King of Persian Empire
c. 559-531 BCE
Herodotus writes between c. 460 – 425 BCE
Thucydides writes c. 410-400 BCE
Croesus king of Lydia c. 560-546 BCE
Cambyses King of Persian Emp.
c. 531-522 BCE
Darius I King of Persian Empire
c. 521-486 BCE
Xerxes I King of Persian Empire
c.485-465 BCE
Artaxerxes I King of Persian Empire
c. 464-424 BCE
Darius II King of Persian Empire
c. 423-405 BCE
L A T E A R C H A I C P E R I O D c. 600 - 480 BCE
Nabonidus king of Babylon c. 555-539 BCE
Unit 2: What was History to the First Historians? Timeline
Ionian revolt c. 499-494 BCE
Battle of Marathon 490 BCE
Battle of Salamis 480 BCE
Plague in Athens
430-429 BCE
Thucydides exiled from Athens
424/423 BCE
Peace of Nicias 422-416 BCE
Pericles’ funeral oration 431 BCE
Pisistratus tyrant of Athens
546-527 BCE
Hippias tyrant of Athens
527-510 BCE
Turmoil after death of Cambyses 522-521 BCE
Persepolis
Pasargadae
Darius I (ruled 521 – 486 BCE) faced a revolt by Greek cities in Ionia/Western Anatolia from 499 – 494 BCE
Persepolis
Pasargadae
The Athenians broke their alliance with the Persians to assist in the Ionian revolt
Persepolis
Pasargadae
Darius I (ruled 521 – 486 BCE) sent an army to attack Greece in 490 BCE
Greece
Athens
The Plain of Marathon in Attica
Athens
Plataea
Likely question on the second essay:
Compare Herodotus’ and Thucydides’ attitudes or opinions about the Athenian democracy. Use specific examples from Herodotus’ Histories and Thucydides’ History of the Peloponnesian War to support your answer.
Judging from what we read in books 3 and 5 what opinion does Herodotus have of democracy generally?
And what opinion does he have of the Athenian democracy in particular?
For instance, does he think Athens was better or worse off with democracy in place and how can we tell?
Review Herodotus’ description of the Battle of Marathon. Be sure to discuss what he suggests is at stake in this battle and his assessment of the Athenians’ performance.
Then discuss whether the account he gives of Marathon is consistent with his comments on Athenian democracy in book 5.78.
Helmet of the Athenian general Miltiades, dedicated to Zeus in the sanctuary at Olympia after the battle of Marathon c. 490 BCE
But when the Athenians came to grips with the barbarians, what a fine account they made of themselves! Herodotus 6.112 (translated by Blanco, 2013)
The Plain of Marathon in Attica
The Mound of the Athenians at Marathon in Attica, c. 490-480 BCE All 192 Athenians who died in the battle were cremated and buried together
Likely question on the second essay:
What were Herodotus’ aims in writing his Histories? How well does he stay on topic with these stated aims? Please use examples from the passages we have read to support your answer.
Herodotus’ aims, in his own words:
…So that the actions of people shall not fade with time, so that the great and admirable achievements of both Greeks and barbarians shall not go unrenowned (i.e., lose their glory), and, among other things, to set forth the reasons why they waged war on each other.
Herodotus book 1 (translated by Blanco 2013)
Likely question on the second essay:
What were Herodotus’ aims in writing his Histories? How well does he stay on topic with these stated aims? Please use examples from the passages we have read to support your answer.
Athens
Sparta
Delphi, site of the oracle of Apollo
Delphi
Sardis
Tegea
List all the examples of prophetic oracles and prophetic dreams from Herodotus’ Histories that you can think of.
Discuss which ones stuck out to you the most and why.
Athens
The Plain of Marathon in Attica
Athens
Plataea
In 490 BCE The Persians planned to put the former Athenian tyrant Hippias back in charge of Athens
Salamis
Themistokles interpreted the “walls of wood” referred to by the Oracle at Delphi as referring to the Athenian fleet
Athens
Plataea
Salamis
Herodotus was really interested in the story about what happened to Epizelus at Marathon
The Plain of Marathon in Attica
Attic krater (wine bowl), c. 480 – 460 BCE Athena, Achilles, and Hector
Psammetichus (Psamtik I), Egyptian Pharaoh c. 664-610 BCE
Phrygia
Egypt
Book 2 of Herodotus’ Histories is a description of the customs, geography, and animals of Egypt
In book 2 and in book 3.98-118 Herodotus describes features and customs of people who live in faraway lands. List as many of these as you can recall.
Xerxes (ruled c. 486 - 465 BCE) on invading Greece (according to Herodotus):
At last I have found a way to win for Persia not only glory but a country as large and as rich as our own – indeed richer than our own – and at the same time to get satisfaction and revenge...if we crush the Athenians and their neighbors who dwell in the land of Pelops the Phrygian (i.e., the Peloponnese), we shall so extend the empire of Persia that its boundaries will be the God’s own sky…
Herodotus 7.8 (translated by De Selincourt 1954)
The Spartan 300 and an assortment of other Greeks delayed the Persians at Thermopylae
Thermopylae
Athens
Sparta
Artemisium
Thermopylae
Athens
Sparta
Delphi, site of the oracle of Apollo
Delphi
Thermopylae
Athens
Sparta
The Persians sacked Athens in 480 BCE, demolishing the temples on the Athenian acropolis
Delphi
The Greeks defeated the Persians at sea at the battle of Salamis in 480 BCE
Athens
Plataea
Salamis
Before the battle, they swore an oath:
The Greeks who fought at Plataea were supposed to…
Stay friends with each other
Stay enemies with the Persians and any Greeks who helped them
Leave the sanctuaries destroyed by the Persians in ruins
In 479 BCE a coalition of Greek City states fought the Persian army at Plataea
Athens
Plataea
Salamis
For Next Class (10/29)
READ: Thucydides, Book 1.1-23, 62-88; Book 2.1-33
