From: parys@ccsua.ctstateu.edu
Subject: Re: A Message for you Mr. President: How do you know what happened?
Keywords: Success
Lines: 140
Nntp-Posting-Host: ccsua.ctstateu.edu
Organization: Yale University, Department of Computer Science, New Haven, CT

I told some friends of mine two weeks ago that Koresh was dead.  The FBI and
the BATF could not let a man like that live.  He was a testimonial to their
stupidity and lies.    

Now before everyone gets crazy with me, let me say that Koresh was crazy as 
a bed bug, but out government was crazier...and they lied to us.

They told us compound had been under survaillance for quite some time.  Yet, 
whoever was watching the place failed to see that Koresh went jogging and into
town on a regular basis.  Everyone in the area claimed to have seen him and 
wondered why they didn't pick him up then.  There are two possible answers.
First, they didn't see him.  What kind of survaillance is that?  Second, they
didn't care.  They wanted a confrontation.  They wanted publicity and they got
it.

After the first battle, they told us that they did not know he knew they were
coming.  They also said it would have been foolish to go in knowing that.
Well, we know now that they intercepted the informants call and went in anyway.

Did they explore all of the possibilities for ending the seige?  According to
them they did, but according to the Hartford Courant, the woman that raised
Koresh (His Grandmother) was not allowed to go in and see him.                 
 The FBI agent who she spoke with was Bob Ricks and according to the paper he
said:

"A lot of people think if you just talk to them logically they will come out.
His grandmother raised Vernon Howell; (Koresh's Real name)  she didn't raise
David Koresh."

Someone who raises you and loves you does not speak to you strickly on a
logical level.  There is also an emotional level on which they can reach you.

Here's another one.  All during this operation the FBI has been claiming that
they feared a mass suicide and that is one of the reasons that something must
be done.  Now they claim they never thought he would do it?

I knew they were going to do something when they started talking about how
much money this was costing.  That was the start of the "Justification" part
part of the plan.  That's when I knew it would come soon.

But, back to the plan.  It is considered "Cruel and Unusal Punishment" to
execute criminals in the minds of many people, but look at what's acceptable.

They knew the parents (adults) had gas masks.  They did not know, or were not
sure, if the children had them.  So the plan was to pour the gas into the 
compound.  The mothers, seeing what the gas was doing to their children were
supposed to run out and that would only leave the men to deal with.

I spent two years in the army and like everyother veteran I went through CBR
(Chemical, Biological Radiological) warfare training.  Part of that training
is going into a room filled with the same stuff that the children were
subjected to.  To make the stuff really interesting the gas also has a chemical 
agent that irritates the skin.  You think its on fire.

I have no doubts the children would become hysterical.  Its not the kind of
thing you never want to do again.  This was the plan, the final solution.

We waited 444 days for our hostages to come home from Iran.  We gave these
people 51 days.  

I stated on several occasions that there was absolutely nothing in this whole
thing that the government could point to as a success.  Well, FBI agent Ricks
changed my mind.  Again a newclip from the Hartford Courant:

"And while expressing regret at the loss of life, he suggested that the
operation had been at least a modified success because not a single federal
shot had been fired and not a single federal agent had been hurt."

It took 17 dead children to get us that new definition of success.

One more thought.  The government claimed that they believed he had automatic
weapons on the premises. 
                                                      
        HE HAD A LICENSE FOR THE 50 CALIBER MACHINE GUN!

THEY KNEW DAMN WELL HE HAD ONE. THEY ALSO KNEW HE HAD IT LEGALLY!

Still, without the element of surprise they sent in agents to get him.
For all of this my President takes full responsibility.  What a guy!
I hope he gets it.
















 














In article <exuptr.1431.0@exu.ericsson.se>, exuptr@exu.ericsson.se (Patrick Taylor, The Sounding Board) writes:
> In article <11974@prijat.cs.uofs.edu> bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
> 
>>Before you go absolving the BATF & FBI of all blame in this incident, you should
>>probably be aware of two important facts.
>>1.  There is no such thing as non-toxic tear gas.  Tear gas is non-breathable
>>    remaining in it's presence will cause nausea and vomiting, followed eventually
>>    by siezures and death.  Did the FBI know the physical health of all the people
>>    they exposed??  Any potential heart problems among the B-D's??
> 
> No doubt it is dangerous stuff when concentrated.
> 
>>2.  Have you ever seen a tear gas canister??  Tear gas is produced by burning a
>>    chemical in the can.  The fumes produced are tear gas.  The canister has a 
>>    warning printed on the side of it.  "Contact with flamable material can result
>>    in fire."  Now, how many of these canisters did they throw inside a building 
>>    they admited was a fire-trap??
> 
> None.  They used non-incindiary methods, which means they produced the gas 
> outside the building and pumped it in via the tanks.
> 
> ---
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>     Patrick Taylor, Ericsson Network Systems  THX-1138
>     exuptr@exu.ericsson.se                    "Don't let the .se fool you"
