From: pat@rwing.UUCP (Pat Myrto)
Subject: Re: "militia" (incredibly long)
Organization: Totally Unorganized
Lines: 75

In article <C5n0vy.EJ6@ulowell.ulowell.edu> jrutledg@cs.ulowell.edu (John Lawrence Rutledge) writes:
<In article <1qna9m$nq8@transfer.stratus.com>, cdt@sw.stratus.com (C. D. Tavares) writes:
<-> In article <C5L0n2.5LL@ulowell.ulowell.edu>, jrutledg@cs.ulowell.edu (John Lawrence Rutledge) writes:
<-> > But, do you knew how much organization is required to training a large
<-> > group of poeple twice a year.  Just to try to get the same people
<-> > every year, provide a basic training to new people so they can
<-> > be integrated into the force, and find a suitable location, it 
<-> > requires a continually standing committee of organizers.  
<-> 
<-> Again, my response is, "so what?"  Is Mr. Rutledge arguing that since
<-> the local and federal governments have abandoned their charter to support
<-> such activity, and passed laws prohibiting private organizations from 
<-> doing so, that they have eliminated the basis for the RKBA?   On the
<-> contrary, to anyone who understands the game, they have strengthened it.
<
<No, I originally argued that the Second Amendment was "a little bit
<and an anachronism."  These prohibiting laws are examples why the are
<an anachronism.  After all, laws in made by representatives of the 
<people.  These representatives of the people have already decided
<that the Second Amendment does not apply or is too broad in some
<cases.  Since these representatives feel an unconditional 
<interpretation is not wanted, then it is probable that they majority
<of the people feel the same way.  If this is so, it is an example
<of the people using their power of government.  If this is not
<how the people feel, the people should stand up and state their wishes.

Wrong.  Neglecting that the government and media have bullshitted the
people almost nonstop on this issue, Constitutional limitations are
there to prevent a 'tyrrany of the majority'.  For example, a majority
could vote that given ethnics have no rights, are not people, etc.
and it would fly using the logic above.

When government feels the Constitution is not right for the times,
there is a procedure called an AMENDMENT TO THE CONSTITUTION.  THis
is deliberately difficult, and cumbersome, to prevent abuse of those
who decide to ignore the people, or impose unjust policies of a
majority on a minority.   A lynch mob is a majority, remember, outvoting
the hangee.

What the government is doing are VIOLATIONS, end-runs around the
limitations on the government, probably because they know that the
people would be very hard to convince that a good intention is behind
tampering with the Bill of Rights.  Government propeganda on guns has
been very strong and persistant, but not THAT strong.  And it just
shows how gullible the people have become to "I am from the government
and am here to help you sort of line".  We have been lied to, fed
half truths, rigged stats, while the government knows their control
laws have no effect on crime.  They want a government monopoly on
force, pure and simple.  Do you REALLY want the government to be able
to override Constitutional limitations by a simple vote of a bunch
of elitists (congresscritters)?  I sure don't.  The Founding Fathers
sure as hell didn't, either.

<> Mox nix, Mr. Rutledge.  YOU are the only one here claiming that the
<-> RKBA is dependent on the existence of a top-flight, well-regulated
<-> militia.  Why this is a false assumption has already been posted a 
<-> number of times.  
<
<No, I simple stated that the people have a right to "join a well
<organized militia."  And I have also stated that a militia that
<meets once or twice a year is clearly "well organized."  And this
<state of readiness that I have claimed the people have a "right"
<to, is the same state of readiness expected of the militia as stated
<by Hamilton. 

You better read the Senate Subcommitte on the Constitution regarding the
Second Amendment, and a linguist's analisys of the Second itself.
IN the meanwhile, show us some stuff to back up your assertions.
And yes, I have the above mentioned documents (and more) online.

-- 
pat@rwing.uucp      [Without prejudice UCC 1-207]     (Pat Myrto) Seattle, WA
         If all else fails, try:       ...!uunet!pilchuck!rwing!pat
WISDOM: "Only two things are infinite; the universe and human stupidity,
         and I am not sure about the former."              - Albert Einstien
