From: pyotr@halcyon.com (Peter D. Hampe)
Subject: Phill says Koresh == Hitler, was Welcome to Police State USA
Organization: Northwest Nexus Inc.
Lines: 90
NNTP-Posting-Host: nwfocus.wa.com

hallam@dscomsa.desy.de (Phill Hallam-Baker) writes:

>|>>the murderes of four police officers to justice perhaps we could
>|>>hear it.
>|>
>|>They _had_ a sure-fire method: keep them bottled up and talk them to death or
>|>surrender without giving him justification for some looney-tune religious
>|>stunt.
>|>
>|>Phil, I've been reading your postings for months and I'm convinced that you
>|>will back anything, no matter how damaging it may be to yours or anyone
>|>else's rights if you think it will hurt people you don't like.  It's people
>|>with that attitude that set up the preconditions for the Holocaust, a process
>|>that is in place _now_ in this country, even if the tattered, pitiful remains
>|>of the Constitution is slowing its progress.  This isn't a Libertarian issue,
>|>others may argue that line, but from a strictly Constitutional view of a
>|>democratic gov't, what the FBI and BATF did was wrong, wrong, wrong, even if
>|>their _reasons_ for trying to arrest Koresh were 100% right.  _Anything_ that
>|>leads to the deaths of 17 children, if nothing else touches your stoney
>|>heart, is _wrong_ no matter who pushed the button.  For God's sake, man, get
>|>your morality back.

>The person who murdered 17 children was Koresh. He kept them there and 
>brought about their deaths deliberately.

>You may consider that I am a complete bastard and a not very nice chap.
>Thats quite true. I don't pretend to be. Being nice is what amateurs
>try to do. If you want to talk politics you are talking hard decisions
>such as whether the lives of the troops should be risked attempting
>to rescue the children. Anyone who has held the office of President
>of the United States since FDR has held the threat that if the USA
>or its allies were to be threatened then the USA would risk nuclear 
>Holocaust in order to protect freedom. Beleive it or not, that is not
>the sort of threat that nice chaps make. Do they have a gun nutters
>section of the US version of CND by any chance?


>There are cases where society has to be protected from
>madmen such as Koresh or Hitler. If it were not for the consideration
>of the 17 children in there the question of the tactics to be used would
>not be a matter of anything but academic significance. It is not for
>the govt to prevent people from commiting mass suicide.

>The latest reports are that cult members were shot attempting to
>leave the compound by Koresh loyalists during the fire. If proven
>that would entail the final nail in the coffin of those who want to
>promote Koresh as some sort of role model or hero.

>I need hardly add that it is Koresh that has created the Holocaust in
>this case by the deliberate arson of the ranch appocalypse.

Let me see if I got this right.

Group of religious plinter schismatics erect a compound
and after at least fifty years of peaceful co-existance
with the outside community (having shoot outs only with
each other) - this makes them dangerous.  Prior history
would seem to indicate they are only dangerous to themselves.

Last I knew there was no National Branch Davidian Party
blaming the debacle in VeitNam on Foreign Meddlers and
three-two beer, calling for the Rounding up of Meat Packers,
Growers and Slaughter Houses.

You want tough political choices - how about letting odd balls
be odd balls?  (I know, this requires tolerance for 
those that go into Government - but we all know people
who have no useful skills.)


ith the death of the children everybody is getting
real upset - what about the other 40 plus people?
I suppose that you consider children to be property
of the state with the family as custodians. (In the
States its the other way around - children are parental property.)
If what you consider a Corrupt Government demands that
you send you children into _their_ tender care - I
suppose that you will obey the State and turn you children
over to their care.  Sorry - I am not as enamoured of the
womb to tomb cradle that is IngSoc.

Gotta go, the beach is calling.
chus
pyotr

-- 
pyotr@halcyon.com Sometimes Pyotr Filipivich, sometimes Owl. 
April 19, 1993 - You realize that this makes twice in two
months that the Government had a Perfect Plan that went awry?

